[Shimmy26]

Does anyone know of any young couples that are having a real financial crisis? I am curious to what extent this puts pressure on a new marriage.

[fuzzy]

Every new couple just starting out has a "financial crisis" to a certain extent. It depends on how much they are getting supported, or if the husband is learning or working......... It actually gets even harder once the kids start coming. Then you have additional expenses such as babysitting.........

As far as putting pressure: I think most girls that marry learning boys are willing to sacrifice. It's something that is understood beforehand. But if something unexpected comes up, then that might put stress on a marriage.

The main thing to remember is that Hashem is running the world, and everything ends up working out.

[SS613]

Unfortunately, most couples I am friends with are having financial problems that are very real. Some of these couples have children, some of these couples do not have children yet. In some cases the husband spent time learning at the beginning of the marriage. In some cases no time was spent learning after the marriage. In all cases both the husband and the wife work. In most cases, there is outside help that is considerable, from babysitting provided for by grandparents to parents giving interest-free loans to keep the couple afloat.

Sadly enough, although there are chatan classes and kallah classes that address taharat hamishpacha and shalom ba'ayit, there are no classes that address financial management and budgeting before the marriage.

Financial management and budgeting is an interest of mine. If anyone would like to share ideas and situations on this thread, I am willing to contribute. A warning to those looking to improve their situation: you will have to change habits if you want to improve/alleviate your situation. Learning financial mangement skills and budgeting requires extreme discipline and will make your habits different from others in the frum community. However, years down the road, you will probably experience great satisfaction and security.

[Faigy]

Quote

there are no classes that address financial management and budgeting before the marriage.

There's a kollel I know about, they have shiurim on this.

But again, you know what they tell you?

Whoever has a cell phone, cut down on it. Not so important, can save you money.
Whoever has a car, cut down on it. Not so important, can save you money.

etc etc.. This much everyone knows. Or maybe not

[Nechama]

SS613, on Feb 25 2004, 02:26 PM, said:

Sadly enough, although there are chatan classes and kallah classes that address taharat hamishpacha and shalom ba'ayit, there are no classes that address financial management and budgeting before the marriage.

Great point. We teach about making good marriage with communication etc, but we really should also be teaching new couples pratical life-skills too- how to buget, monthly and long term, about building good credit history, investments, home-buying etc. (Im sure you can come up with more)

[gewdgal]

Nechama, on Feb 25 2004, 02:54 PM, said:

Great point. We teach about making good marriage with communication etc, but we really should also be teaching new couples pratical life-skills too- how to buget, monthly and long term, about building good credit history, investments, home-buying etc. (Im sure you can come up with more)

Doesnt this really take common sense??

[Jappy19]

a few of my friends, are always saying that they dont have money for this..... and for that........ well im sure it is hard.
but i guess thats the good stuff about bieng unmarried!!! :D

[Pamello]

Here every yingerman is more then capable of dealing with 'properties'.

They do teach it in Kollel :D .

[Faigy]

It's more the fear of not having, than actually not having. Becuase the young couple feel that it's all on their head, they are scared to spend too much, knowing it's all their's. But when you friends tell you they have no money, do not believe. They have more than you think. It's the mentality they take.

[Jappy19]

Quote

They do teach it in Kollel

WOW!! so they do teach someting in kollel.

[Nechama]

gewdgal, on Feb 25 2004, 03:00 PM, said:

Nechama, on Feb 25 2004, 02:54 PM, said:

Great point. We teach about making good marriage with communication etc, but we really should also be teaching new couples pratical life-skills too- how to buget, monthly and long term, about building good credit history, investments, home-buying etc. (Im sure you can come up with more)

Doesnt this really take common sense??

No it doesnt take "common sense," but it does. Meaning- everyone can learn how, if they are taught.
Why not spend 1,000's of $ you dont have every month on your credit card and then be in debit! Lots of people do that because they have not been taught that you cant spend more money than you own and stay aflot. Many people live beyond their means, via common sense you would not do that, but people do it anyways.

PS. Sorry about the Temp out of service, I dont know whats causing it.

[shred]

machshaifa, on Feb 25 2004, 03:20 PM, said:

And no!  Sadly, not all girls who marry Kollel guys are willing to sacrifice some don't even know what it means to sacrifice.

You nailed it right on the button.
Some even do stupid things after the marriage because things don't go exactly how they want. (they don't realize that not everything goes as smooth as they wish.)

[SS613]

I am a huge advocate of teaching financial management to young people in the frum world. The teaching really needs to start at a very young age (practically from birth). One of the largest challenges of being a parent is the ability to raise children into independent adults. This seems to be an area where we, as observant Jews, are failing. The failure, I believe, is rooted in the inability to say no to our children because we do not want them to be mad at us, be different, etc. We seem to have an inability to be brave and put the breaks on spending for many things including, but certainly not limited to public affairs, from bar mitzvahs to vorts to weddings.

Unfortunately, there is an assumption that parents are responsible for getting a young couple started in life. I find this interesting considering that the Rambam states that first a man buys a field, second he builds a house, and third he acquires a wife. Today, the opposite seems true. . . first a boy finds a wife and years later he is forced into some semblance of independence.

I think that so long as young people view their parents as responsible for getting them started in married life, they will not begin to think long term and settle into a career, make appropriate investments, etc.

I, unfortunately, know very few young couples who are on their own two feet.

[SS613]

Faigy, on Feb 25 2004, 02:53 PM, said:

Whoever has a cell phone, cut down on it. Not so important, can save you money.
Whoever has a car, cut down on it. Not so important, can save you money.[/i]

Although advice like this is "common sense," it is worth reinforcing! I believe people believe that savings are built in the hundreds, if not thousands, of dollars. Often times a $20 a month expense that is unnecessary will not be cut out of one's budget because "it is only $20 a month." When expenses are tracked carefully, most people will find that there are areas where they can cut. Willingness to make the cuts is a whole other issue!

[mosheshmeal]

SS613, on Feb 25 2004, 02:26 PM, said:

Sadly enough, although there are chatan classes and kallah classes that address taharat hamishpacha and shalom ba'ayit, there are no classes that address financial management and budgeting before the marriage.

Never thought of that. Great point.

mosheshmeal
.

[cornie]

SS613, on Feb 25 2004, 07:19 PM, said:

I think that so long as young people view their parents as responsible for getting them started in married life, they will not begin to think long term and settle into a career, make appropriate investments, etc.

I, unfortunately, know very few young couples who are on their own two feet.

I think you nailed it. Many newlyweds (and even a few years into marriage!) are not independent at all, ranging from being financially supported by parents, to spending most Shabbosim at their parents' houses, to never making a single yom tov on their own, to not knowing how to make decisions! I think it's a chisaron if a couple lives more at the wife's mother's house than at their own. I mean, if you're not mature enough to be an independent couple and family of your own, then why get married?

When my husband and I got married, it was difficult for us since our parents were the opposite extreme - my parents b'shita did not give any financial support, and his parents were very uninvolved in general. It was only hard because everyone I knew around me was being supported and was always running to mommy for this and that. But you know what? We were also much, much happier to have it our way because it helped make us true, independent adults.

[politico]

Faigy, on Feb 25 2004, 03:04 PM, said:

But when you friends tell you they have no money, do not believe. They have more than you think.

how can you assume that?

[cornie]

politico, on Feb 25 2004, 08:54 PM, said:

Faigy, on Feb 25 2004, 03:04 PM, said:

But when you friends tell you they have no money, do not believe. They have more than you think.

how can you assume that?

Ditto, Politico. The above statement may be true for some but not all.

[Nechama]

cornie, on Feb 25 2004, 08:59 PM, said:

politico, on Feb 25 2004, 08:54 PM, said:

Faigy, on Feb 25 2004, 03:04 PM, said:

But when you friends tell you they have no money, do not believe. They have more than you think.

how can you assume that?

Ditto, Politico. The above statement may be true for some but not all.

Hmm. Maybe this money which they "have but don't have" is the egg nest (nest egg? I forget what its called)- you can have money stored away (for big things, like buying a house) which youre not going to use. Your month to month expenses can be tight then, although you "have money".