Has there ever been a time when an accepted Gadol either decided to step down and just basically quit being a rabbi or a leader, or converted to another religion, or became an atheist altogether? (like Elisha ben Abuya)
Shabbtai Tzvi, obviously. But anyone else? I can think of a few who were talented students in yeshiva and went OTD (like Mordechai Kaplan), and I'm sure there are countless who were simple rabbis, but what about established leaders/gedolim?
*(obviously inspired by the thought of Melech converting and joining a cult)
Gadol quitting or going OTD
Started by
Moshi
, Sep 03 2010 01:28 PM
14 replies to this topic
#2
Bet Chesed
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Gabbai
Posted 03 September 2010 - 01:34 PM
Rabbi Zalman Schachter-Shalomi became a leader after going OTD like Mordechai Kaplan, but that isn't what you're looking for. I don't know about any gedolim.
Blessed be all
#4
jewess
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Godol Hador
Posted 03 September 2010 - 01:39 PM
i don't know a gadol who did this but one of my brothers had a rebbi(vice principal also) in yeshivah who shortly after teaching him left the school, divorced his wife, started living with a male and left religion. He is now frum again (still gay) and has been trying to get the yeshiva to let him come and speak to the kids. it was a major scandal at the time and i am sure others know the story.
#7
goyishrebbe
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Rebbe
Posted 03 September 2010 - 05:05 PM
Chief Rabbi Abraham Seneor during the expulsion from Spain
There was another leading Spanish rabbi 50-100 years before that who converted out and even ended up an bishop in the end. He was born Solomon Ha-Levi and later became known as Bishop Paul of Burgos.
#8
TheDuncePolice
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Knows she doesn't know
Posted 03 September 2010 - 05:19 PM
.
Proud member of the "I don't always wait until I finish reading the thread to respond" club.
Believe me, every heart has its secret sorrows, which the world knows not; and oftentimes we call a man cold when he is only sad. ~ Robert C. Savage
Believe me, every heart has its secret sorrows, which the world knows not; and oftentimes we call a man cold when he is only sad. ~ Robert C. Savage
#9
Snag
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הבל יפצה פי
Posted 04 September 2010 - 10:21 PM
i'm surprised no one has yet mentioned rabbi yochanan, who was a kohen godol for eighty years, and then became a sadducee.Has there ever been a time when an accepted Gadol either decided to step down and just basically quit being a rabbi or a leader, or converted to another religion, or became an atheist altogether? (like Elisha ben Abuya)
Shabbtai Tzvi, obviously. But anyone else? I can think of a few who were talented students in yeshiva and went OTD (like Mordechai Kaplan), and I'm sure there are countless who were simple rabbis, but what about established leaders/gedolim?
*(obviously inspired by the thought of Melech converting and joining a cult)
they translated it? cool!A fascinating book, which is dirt and LH from cover to cover, is David Assaf's
http://www.amazon.co...e/dp/1584658614
interestingly, a hyperintelligent but hassidic friend of mine told me that this book actually reinforces his faith somewhat, since if prof. assaf's extensive research was only able to uncover the relatively few instances of 'dirt' in this book, we can assume that, even if all of his facts are correct, the vast majority of hassidic leaders were indeed free of sin. further proof that one establishes beliefs and then adjusts all facts to fit those beliefs, i suppose.
"Spiritual wants and instincts are as various in the human family as are physical appetites, complexions, and features, and a man is only at his best, morally, when he is equipped with the religious garment whose color and shape and size most nicely accommodate themselves to the spiritual complexion, angularities, and stature of the individual who wears it."
"The despotism of heaven is the one absolutely perfect government. An earthly despotism would be the absolutely perfect earthly government, if the conditions were the same; namely, the despot the perfectest individual of the human race, and his lease of life perpetual. But as a perishable perfect man must die, and leave his despotism in the hands of an imperfect successor, an earthly despotism is not merely a bad form of government, it is the worst form that is possible."
-Mark Twain
"The despotism of heaven is the one absolutely perfect government. An earthly despotism would be the absolutely perfect earthly government, if the conditions were the same; namely, the despot the perfectest individual of the human race, and his lease of life perpetual. But as a perishable perfect man must die, and leave his despotism in the hands of an imperfect successor, an earthly despotism is not merely a bad form of government, it is the worst form that is possible."
-Mark Twain
#11
Dan
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Posted 03 October 2010 - 09:44 AM
Who was the one (talmid of r' meir?) that counted the steps etc. and mentioned that rabbi has hit the tchum?
כלל זה יהא נקוט בידך: מי שאינו רואה את המקום [=ה'] בכל מקום, אינו רואה בשום מקום
איפה נמצא אלוקים? בכל מקום שנותנים לו להיכנס
-Kotzker
נישט אלעס וואס מען טראכט דארף מען זאגען, נישט אלעס וואס מען זאגט דארף מען שרייבען, נישט אלעס וואס מען שרייבט דארף מען דרוקען און נישט אלעס וואס מען דרוקט דארף מען ליינען!
-R' Salanter
יש בן חורין שרוחו רוח של עבד, ויש עבד שרוחו מלאה חירות; הנאמן לעצמיותו – בן חורין הוא, ומי שכל חייו הם רק במה שטוב ויפה בעיני אחרים – הוא עבד
-R' Kook
איפה נמצא אלוקים? בכל מקום שנותנים לו להיכנס
-Kotzker
נישט אלעס וואס מען טראכט דארף מען זאגען, נישט אלעס וואס מען זאגט דארף מען שרייבען, נישט אלעס וואס מען שרייבט דארף מען דרוקען און נישט אלעס וואס מען דרוקט דארף מען ליינען!
-R' Salanter
יש בן חורין שרוחו רוח של עבד, ויש עבד שרוחו מלאה חירות; הנאמן לעצמיותו – בן חורין הוא, ומי שכל חייו הם רק במה שטוב ויפה בעיני אחרים – הוא עבד
-R' Kook
#13
Dan
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Posted 03 October 2010 - 10:01 AM
Right, thanks
I was trying to remember his "old name".. then realized its in the OP.
כלל זה יהא נקוט בידך: מי שאינו רואה את המקום [=ה'] בכל מקום, אינו רואה בשום מקום
איפה נמצא אלוקים? בכל מקום שנותנים לו להיכנס
-Kotzker
נישט אלעס וואס מען טראכט דארף מען זאגען, נישט אלעס וואס מען זאגט דארף מען שרייבען, נישט אלעס וואס מען שרייבט דארף מען דרוקען און נישט אלעס וואס מען דרוקט דארף מען ליינען!
-R' Salanter
יש בן חורין שרוחו רוח של עבד, ויש עבד שרוחו מלאה חירות; הנאמן לעצמיותו – בן חורין הוא, ומי שכל חייו הם רק במה שטוב ויפה בעיני אחרים – הוא עבד
-R' Kook
איפה נמצא אלוקים? בכל מקום שנותנים לו להיכנס
-Kotzker
נישט אלעס וואס מען טראכט דארף מען זאגען, נישט אלעס וואס מען זאגט דארף מען שרייבען, נישט אלעס וואס מען שרייבט דארף מען דרוקען און נישט אלעס וואס מען דרוקט דארף מען ליינען!
-R' Salanter
יש בן חורין שרוחו רוח של עבד, ויש עבד שרוחו מלאה חירות; הנאמן לעצמיותו – בן חורין הוא, ומי שכל חייו הם רק במה שטוב ויפה בעיני אחרים – הוא עבד
-R' Kook
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