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San Francisco Set to Vote on Circumcision Ban


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#1 Tel Aviv

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 10:49 AM

Does anyone know exactly how the foreskin protects against STDs? Also, if the foreskin was left intact, would it make men more promiscuous since the added sexual pleasure from the nerve concentrated foreskin would make sex more addictive?

http://forward.com/a.../#ixzz1MFQ54frS

Don’t Tread on a Sacred Tradition



By Melvin Konner
Published May 11, 2011, issue of May 20, 2011.

A group in San Francisco has collected enough signatures to force a vote on a law that would make it illegal to "circumcise, excise, cut or mutilate the foreskin, testicle or penis of another person who has not attained the age of 18."

This ban, if it passes, might infringe on the First Amendment guarantee to freedom of religion. Constitutional or not, it is without a doubt a slap in the face to Muslims and Jews, an attack on their rights to privacy that would keep them from continuing a millennial tradition of their ancestors, not to mention keeping them from raising their children according to their own conscience and values.

Full text at http://forward.com/a.../#ixzz1MFQ54frS
Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#2 RebDan

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 06:36 PM

Does anyone know exactly how the foreskin protects against STDs? Also, if the foreskin was left intact, would it make men more promiscuous since the added sexual pleasure from the nerve concentrated foreskin would make sex more addictive?


You have it backwards; they're saying that removing the foreskin can prevent some STDs. I'm not sure it's possible to make men think about sex more often. Though there is a Rashi to that effect where Yosef instituted circumcision in Egypt.

#3 Rentsy

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Posted 15 May 2011 - 10:42 AM

I've seen a stele in the Bible Lands museum depicting Egyptian circumcision.

You see it in the Ibn Ezra too, Egyptians did circumcision.

Which means that the passuk in Yehoshua about removing the חרפת מצרים via the re-institutionalization of circumcision needs some work to read peshat, because it makes perfect sense if the Egyptians didn't do circumcision.
רמב"ם הלכות תשובה פרק העשירי, הלכה ב

העובד מאהבה - עוסק בתורה ובמצוות והולך במתיבות החוכמה לא מפני דבר בעולם, לא מפני יראת הרעה ולא כדי לירש הטובה, אלא עושה האמת מפני שהוא אמת

הלכה ג

אהבה גדולה יתרה רבה עזה עד מאד, עד שתהא נפשו קשורה באהבת השם ... וכל שיר השירים משל הוא לענין זה

#4 Tel Aviv

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Posted 15 May 2011 - 10:13 PM

I personally would welcome a complete removal of sexual desire from my brain: I find it to be so distracting. I think it would be great if instead I got an orgasm from, letís say, reading an interesting book.


Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#5 Xi

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Posted 15 May 2011 - 11:16 PM

I personally would welcome a complete removal of sexual desire from my brain: I find it to be so distracting. I think it would be great if instead I got an orgasm from, letís say, reading an interesting book.

Why don't you?
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#6 Tel Aviv

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Posted 15 May 2011 - 11:23 PM

Why don't you?


I suppose I'm just an inferior specimen. :(
Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#7 jewess

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 01:28 AM

I personally would welcome a complete removal of sexual desire from my brain: I find it to be so distracting. I think it would be great if instead I got an orgasm from, letís say, reading an interesting book.

The human species would die out under these circumstances.

#8 Tel Aviv

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 01:58 AM

The human species would die out under these circumstances.


I was just referring to myself, not the human species.

But, for argument's sake, if we were to consider the whole human species, then what would happen is that reproduction would become ideologically based, not the result of uncontrollable lust. The net result would be that all births would be planned: no more children born to financially unprepared parents who could not keep their pants up.

But as I said, I was just referring to myself: I am distracted by women too much. Good thing I'm circumcised: it could have been a lot worse!:biggrin:
Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#9 moe says

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 08:51 AM

I used to feel distracted by women.

Now I feel distracted by other things.
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#10 int

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 10:23 AM

I used to feel distracted by women.

Now I feel distracted by other things.


Men? :)

#11 israeli4ever

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 10:27 AM

I used to feel distracted by women.

Now I feel distracted by other things women.


Disclaimer: The comments made by this poster do not necessarily represent an actual opinion, they are merely the latest output of an infinite amount of monkeys working on Shakespeare
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#12 moe says

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 10:31 AM

both answers earn points for creativity, however neither successfully conveys my intent.
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#13 Tel Aviv

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 11:07 PM

Now I feel distracted by other things.


Hopefully they are good distractions.
Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#14 U Tarzan me Jane

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 03:26 PM

I personally would welcome a complete removal of sexual desire from my brain: I find it to be so distracting. I think it would be great if instead I got an orgasm from, letís say, reading an interesting book.

There are books that can do that... :biggrin:

There is almost no point in debating whether or not SF will ban circumcision, since there is no "loopholes" for religious requirements, it will never hold water, people still have freedom of religion.
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#15 GoodEats!

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 08:58 AM

People who are trying to push this law really think that the practice is cruel. What if a religious group were doing something really cruel to babies in the name of religion in America? Something would have to be done.

#16 moe says

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 09:47 AM

People who are trying to push this law really think that the practice is cruel. What if a religious group were doing something really cruel to babies in the name of religion in America? Something would have to be done.

let them ban plastic surgeries, or piercings first
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#17 israeli4ever

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 09:55 AM

let them ban plastic surgeries, or piercings first


it probably is illegal to do elective plastic surgery on a child.....
some piercings are ok though...
Disclaimer: The comments made by this poster do not necessarily represent an actual opinion, they are merely the latest output of an infinite amount of monkeys working on Shakespeare
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"Frumkeit without Mentchlichkeit is not Yiddishkeit!" - Razie

"If you don't sin... Jesus died for nothing."

"because teaching is all about obscuration and obfuscation.."
- Snag

#18 moe says

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 10:28 AM

it probably is illegal to do elective plastic surgery on a child.....
some piercings are ok though...

they don't do harelip surgeries?
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#19 israeli4ever

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 10:41 AM

it probably is illegal to do elective plastic surgery on a child.....
some piercings are ok though...



they don't do harelip surgeries?


note the elective, correcting a deformity is different...
Disclaimer: The comments made by this poster do not necessarily represent an actual opinion, they are merely the latest output of an infinite amount of monkeys working on Shakespeare
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"Frumkeit without Mentchlichkeit is not Yiddishkeit!" - Razie

"If you don't sin... Jesus died for nothing."

"because teaching is all about obscuration and obfuscation.."
- Snag

#20 moe says

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 11:08 AM

note the elective, correcting a deformity is different...

it is different, but it is also not a medical necessity.

circumcision is also not completely "elective." Although its necessity, or value is not medical, or cosmetic, it is not senseless mutilation. It carries great meaning to those who perform it.
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