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Israel Leads the World in IVF


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#1 Zionist Jew

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Posted 28 August 2011 - 09:39 PM

Super-Jews are right around the corner:

http://www.nytimes.c...?pagewanted=all

Israel is the world capital of in vitro fertilization and the hospital, which performs about 7,000 of the procedures each year, is one of the busiest fertilization clinics in the world.

Unlike countries where couples can go broke trying to conceive with the assistance of costly medical technology, Israel provides free, unlimited IVF procedures for up to two “take-home babies” until a woman is 45. The policy has made Israelis the highest per capita users of the procedure in the world.


Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#2 starwolf

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Posted 28 August 2011 - 11:17 PM

The point of the article was that IVF is common in Israel--and that it is used to make babies. Not designer babies.
Generally, for people who are having trouble conceiving--not ones that wish to select for certain traits.

Although if one did wish to select for traits, and have the ability to do so, reading comprehension and the ability to distinguish good science and medicine from junk might be on the to of the list......

הַתְקַשֵּׁר מַעֲדַנּוֹת כִּימָה אוֹ-מֹשְׁכוֹת כְּסִיל תְּפַתֵּחַ


doubt not through the ages one increasing purpose runs, and the thoughts of men are widened with the process of the suns.

#3 Zionist Jew

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Posted 28 August 2011 - 11:49 PM

Part of the embryo selection process is disposing of those that have identifiable genetic diseases, such as Tay Sachs. But, they are not looking for genes that give higher intelligence and high conscientiousness. Hopefully, this will change pretty soon.
Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#4 starwolf

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 12:13 AM

Part of the embryo selection process is disposing of those that have identifiable genetic diseases, such as Tay Sachs.

Yes, but that is not the reason that people are doing this.....

הַתְקַשֵּׁר מַעֲדַנּוֹת כִּימָה אוֹ-מֹשְׁכוֹת כְּסִיל תְּפַתֵּחַ


doubt not through the ages one increasing purpose runs, and the thoughts of men are widened with the process of the suns.

#5 Zionist Jew

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 02:36 AM

Yes, but that is not the reason that people are doing this.....


Is it your opinion that every customer to these clinics cannot conceive naturally?
Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#6 Razie

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 03:33 AM

Part of the embryo selection process is disposing of those that have identifiable genetic diseases, such as Tay Sachs. But, they are not looking for genes that give higher intelligence and high conscientiousness. Hopefully, this will change pretty soon.

Where do you see this? It's not mentioned in the article. Genetically typing the embryos before implantantion is NOT part the normal embryo selection process. Not in Israel, not in the US. Not by a long shot. Although it's an available procedure when warranted, it's extremely costly and destroys some embryos in the process. It is done generally only after repeated unexplained miscarriages or where it is known that both parents are carriers of something awful. But that's not an Israeli thing nor a common IVF thing.

#7 starwolf

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 04:41 AM


Is it your opinion that every customer to these clinics cannot conceive naturally?

I could not say what reasons every patient has for using these clinics. I do know that these procedures are inconvenient, troublesome, and in many cases not pain-free. The vast majority of patients are there for a number of reasons: either they are having trouble conceiving in the usual manner, or they wish to use sperm from a donor who, for whatever reason, is not capable or does not wish to conceive in the usual way, or they don't have a partner...etc. Very few, if any use these clinics for purposes of reproductive engineering.

Let's just call this my very well-informed opinion.

הַתְקַשֵּׁר מַעֲדַנּוֹת כִּימָה אוֹ-מֹשְׁכוֹת כְּסִיל תְּפַתֵּחַ


doubt not through the ages one increasing purpose runs, and the thoughts of men are widened with the process of the suns.

#8 Zionist Jew

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 05:07 AM

I could not say what reasons every patient has for using these clinics. I do know that these procedures are inconvenient, troublesome, and in many cases not pain-free. The vast majority of patients are there for a number of reasons: either they are having trouble conceiving in the usual manner, or they wish to use sperm from a donor who, for whatever reason, is not capable or does not wish to conceive in the usual way, or they don't have a partner...etc. Very few, if any use these clinics for purposes of reproductive engineering.

Let's just call this my very well-informed opinion.


I can't say that all Jews wish to manipulate their genetics for the better, but it is very common: http://www.amazon.co...14612256&sr=8-1
Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#9 starwolf

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 05:55 AM


I can't say that all Jews wish to manipulate their genetics for the better, but it is very common: http://www.amazon.co...14612256&sr=8-1

I don't think that your opinion of what is common among Jews has any basis in reality. After all,wasn't it you who claimed that Jews don't eat junk food?

And I certainly don't think that John Glad is representative of Jewish opinion.

הַתְקַשֵּׁר מַעֲדַנּוֹת כִּימָה אוֹ-מֹשְׁכוֹת כְּסִיל תְּפַתֵּחַ


doubt not through the ages one increasing purpose runs, and the thoughts of men are widened with the process of the suns.

#10 Zionist Jew

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 06:04 AM

I don't think that your opinion of what is common among Jews has any basis in reality.


I feel the same way about your opinions.
Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#11 israeli4ever

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 10:42 AM


I feel the same way about your opinions.

Zing!! :rolleyes:
Disclaimer: The comments made by this poster do not necessarily represent an actual opinion, they are merely the latest output of an infinite amount of monkeys working on Shakespeare
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"If you don't sin... Jesus died for nothing."

"because teaching is all about obscuration and obfuscation.."
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#12 starwolf

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:35 AM

Zing!! :rolleyes:

this is all part of my plan to help the FDA monitor his posts, and prepare to kidnap him and fill him full of artificial hormones and Monsanto-made additives.

Soon he will be posting "Frankenfood is good for you! Supplements are bad!" Eat at McDonalds!"

הַתְקַשֵּׁר מַעֲדַנּוֹת כִּימָה אוֹ-מֹשְׁכוֹת כְּסִיל תְּפַתֵּחַ


doubt not through the ages one increasing purpose runs, and the thoughts of men are widened with the process of the suns.

#13 Zionist Jew

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:38 AM

Where do you see this? It's not mentioned in the article. Genetically typing the embryos before implantantion is NOT part the normal embryo selection process. Not in Israel, not in the US. Not by a long shot. Although it's an available procedure when warranted, it's extremely costly and destroys some embryos in the process. It is done generally only after repeated unexplained miscarriages or where it is known that both parents are carriers of something awful. But that's not an Israeli thing nor a common IVF thing.


I've already posted tons of references in the past regarding embryo selection and the use of sperm banks to find intelligent Ashkenazi sperm. Is everyone getting so edgy because I'm posting this on a public forum? It's not like anyone outside the community reads it or anything.
Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#14 Savannah

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:40 AM

I've already posted tons of references in the past regarding embryo selection and the use of sperm banks to find intelligent Ashkenazi sperm. Is everyone getting so edgy because I'm posting this on a public forum? It's not like anyone outside the community reads it or anything.

Wrong.

#15 starwolf

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:44 AM


I've already posted tons of references in the past regarding embryo selection and the use of sperm banks to find intelligent Ashkenazi sperm. Is everyone getting so edgy because I'm posting this on a public forum? It's not like anyone outside the community reads it or anything.

Nobody is getting edgy. The only reason that anyone would care is that you are consistently wrong, and it's a little embarrassing to have the forum filled up with your mishegas.

הַתְקַשֵּׁר מַעֲדַנּוֹת כִּימָה אוֹ-מֹשְׁכוֹת כְּסִיל תְּפַתֵּחַ


doubt not through the ages one increasing purpose runs, and the thoughts of men are widened with the process of the suns.

#16 Zionist Jew

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:45 AM

Zing!! :rolleyes:


It was not supposed to be a zing, but a fact; I'm not interested in battles of wits: I'm here to share my ideas, whether they take or not. Seriously, my feelings don't get hurt when people call me names: rather, a good rational counter-argument is the best way to crush my spirits.
Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#17 Zionist Jew

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:49 AM

Wrong.


One person out of 100,000 really doesn't count for much. But, I went ahead and changed the title anyway.
Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#18 Razie

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 12:28 PM


I've already posted tons of references in the past regarding embryo selection and the use of sperm banks to find intelligent Ashkenazi sperm. Is everyone getting so edgy because I'm posting this on a public forum? It's not like anyone outside the community reads it or anything.

It has nothing to do with concern over who reads it. You are just plain wrong. Maybe if you had any experience with this - which your ignorance shows you do not - you would know.

Many people here are VERY familiar with IVF and some are even familiar with sperm banks. Your facts are extraordinarily wrong. IVF does not select embryos for genetic traits except on the extremely rare occasion when there's a known or suspected genetic ABNORMALITY that would have resulted in miscarriage or infant death or similar. There is no instituted way to select embryos for intelligence or whatnot. The VAST MAJORITY of IVF cases do not involve any kind of genetic testing of embryos. They are simply graded on their likelihood to implant and result in pregnancy, and the ones that appear most likely to implant (based on number of cells and how fragmented they are) are selected.

Furthermore, while sperm banks do allow people to choose more intelligent donors, people can also be selective in dating/marriage which is also "engineering" the children of such union. The advantage sperm banks have is that maybe a woman can get pregnant with a guy who wouldn't marry her in real life. But it's not like anything else is being manipulated or engineered. But beyond that, Ashkenazi is definitely NOT something that sperm bank clients seek out as any kind of general rule. In fact, it is more often avoided than sought out because of the associated diseases. Most sperm banks give other indicators for intelligence, so if intelligence is important, clients can select on grades or test scores or occupation. But they don't select on "Ashkenazi"

#19 Zionist Jew

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 12:47 PM

which your ignorance shows you do not


You are correct: I am very ignorant. I apologize.

The only reason that anyone would care is that you are consistently wrong, and it's a little embarrassing to have the forum filled up with your mishegas.


I have to agree with you: I am always wrong and have been a great embarrassment to this forum. Please forgive me.
Life Extension Foundation: http://www.lef.org/
Alliance for Natural Health: http://www.anh-usa.org/
American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine: http://www.worldhealth.net/

Sometimes I wonder why some elites work so hard in an unethical manner to gain wealth and power: they can't take any of their wealth and power with them when they die. Philosophically looking at it, if there is a G-d, they will have an eternity of suffering to pay for their crimes against humanity. And if there is no G-d, then once they die, they will have no memories and conscious awareness of their success in life because their consciousness and memories are lost for eternity, becoming nothing more than dirt in the ground. So, these elites in the end lose either way. The 100 years of life living like a king is just a drop of water in the infinite ocean of time that they will experience suffering at the hands of G-d, or not experience in a state of non-existence.

#20 israeli4ever

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Posted 29 August 2011 - 12:54 PM

...
Furthermore, while sperm banks do allow people to choose more intelligent donors, people can also be selective in dating/marriage which is also "engineering" the children of such union. The advantage sperm banks have is that maybe a woman can get pregnant with a guy who wouldn't marry her in real life. But it's not like anything else is being manipulated or engineered. But beyond that, Ashkenazi is definitely NOT something that sperm bank clients seek out as any kind of general rule. In fact, it is more often avoided than sought out because of the associated diseases. Most sperm banks give other indicators for intelligence, so if intelligence is important, clients can select on grades or test scores or occupation. But they don't select on "Ashkenazi"

If people would just be properly informed, they would choose Ashkenazi. The sperm banks are doing a disservice by not offering that as an option...
Disclaimer: The comments made by this poster do not necessarily represent an actual opinion, they are merely the latest output of an infinite amount of monkeys working on Shakespeare
________________________________



"Frumkeit without Mentchlichkeit is not Yiddishkeit!" - Razie

"If you don't sin... Jesus died for nothing."

"because teaching is all about obscuration and obfuscation.."
- Snag




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