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Why shouldn't moderation be discussed in an open forum?


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77 replies to this topic

#1 int

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 08:42 PM

In one of the threads complaining about moderation closing another thread, a moderator said that the poster should use PM to discuss it, and not bring up the issue in a public forum. Why should that be? Moderation decisions should be transparent, for all of the board to see, so that the entire board can perform checks and balances on the moderators - making sure they are indeed only operating within the code of 'board guidelines' and not wildly censoring content without any consistent rules at all.

#2 DQ

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 08:52 PM

In one of the threads complaining about moderation closing another thread, a moderator said that the poster should use PM to discuss it, and not bring up the issue in a public forum. Why should that be? Moderation decisions should be transparent, for all of the board to see, so that the entire board can perform checks and balances on the moderators - making sure they are indeed only operating within the code of 'board guidelines' and not wildly censoring content without any consistent rules at all.


I agree completely. It irked me as well when I saw that post.

#3 Xi

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 08:54 PM

I agree completely. It irked me as well when I saw that post.


Especially since moderation itself isn't kept to PMs.
Xi is intimidating, in an endearing sort of way. --Gretchen

#4 Rachel

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:00 PM

Especially since moderation itself isn't kept to PMs.


Absolutely, as threads and posts disappear for no apparent reason. Members want to know what is going on. I think it's quite reasonable for members to want an explanation.
Authentic jews work in climate controlled offices. Physical exertion is for goyim. - Melech

I think that should be the answer to everything on H.com. It was God's plan that these kids should end up in prison in Japan, just as it was God's plan that certain 8th graders shouldn't be accepted to either of the two schools they applied to. And also that a thirteen-year old should have a kid and that certain people should dream of sex with the president. It solves all problems with no need for discussion. - Xi

#5 comfortingsong

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:02 PM

But the point is that the those in charge don't agree. They have clearly demonstrated that the board guidelines are not being used anymore and that moderation is up to their discretion, and that alone. So, since the board guidelines are not being used as guidelines, that means that checks and balances are not necessary and don't need to be looked out for.

And get ready for this thread to be locked in 1...2...3....

#6 Razie

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:03 PM

One very longstanding member has already deleted her account over this issue.

#7 Silent J

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:06 PM

Not that anyone here is trying to hide their actions. We do offer the answers that inquiring minds are looking for via PM.

The reason for this, we feel, is obvious. Open discussion on such issues will only fill the board with dozens, if not hundreds of topics, on moderator actions. On top of that, these topics usually end with one party being resentful, and adds negativity to the board as a whole.
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#8 comfortingsong

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:11 PM

The reason for this, we feel, is obvious. Open discussion on such issues will only fill the board with dozens, if not hundreds of topics, on moderator actions. On top of that, these topics usually end with one party being resentful, and adds negativity to the board as a whole.

As you can see, the lack of open discussions is what is filling the board with dozens of complaints right now. It is not helping to direct everyone to PM. There are many members who are interested in hearing these answers. Answering each and every person via PM, when we all want to know, is a waste of everyone's time.

On top of that, these topics usually end with one party being resentful, and adds negativity to the board as a whole.

The opposite. This lack of openness and transparency and what appears to be lack of appropriate moderation based on board guidelines is what is causing the board to feel resentful and negative.

#9 int

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:13 PM

Not that anyone here is trying to hide their actions. We do offer the answers that inquiring minds are looking for via PM.

The reason for this, we feel, is obvious. Open discussion on such issues will only fill the board with dozens, if not hundreds of topics, on moderator actions. On top of that, these topics usually end with one party being resentful, and adds negativity to the board as a whole.


When a thread gets deleted and the OP gets a message with an explanation via PM, everyone else is left in the dark. This detracts from the pleasantness of the board's atmosphere. But more importantly, it pits the point of view of the moderator against that of the OP, and the latter is left with little recourse. The moderators are only human and make mistakes, and so it would be beneficial if the entire board could judge (via discussion) whether a moderating action was right or not [with 'right' being defined here as 'consistent with board guidelines'].

#10 Silent J

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:14 PM

As you can see, the lack of open discussions is what is filling the board with dozens of complaints right now. It is not helping to direct everyone to PM. There are many members who are interested in hearing these answers. Answering each and every person via PM, when we all want to know, is a waste of everyone's time.


Hmm. I don't see the board being filled with dozens of complaints. If we say that members can get their answers via PM, why hasn't anyone taken the time to send me one?

The opposite. This lack of openness and transparency and what appears to be lack of appropriate moderation based on board guidelines is what is causing the board to feel resentful and negative.


I don't see any resent or negativity except what's in this thread. Can you post an example?
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#11 Razie

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:16 PM

Hmm. I don't see the board being filled with dozens of complaints. If we say that members can get their answers via PM, why hasn't anyone taken the time to send me one?



I don't see any resent or negativity except what's in this thread. Can you post an example?

Because people know it will get deleted. There's tons of anger. A lot of it is discussed in chat since it can't be discussed here. I've been angry at a lot of mod actions, but given the lack of trust and my lack of confidence in fixing anything through mod PM, I'd rather vent in chat.

#12 comfortingsong

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:17 PM

Hmm. I don't see the board being filled with dozens of complaints. If we say that members can get their answers via PM, why hasn't anyone taken the time to send me one?

There is half a dozen in this thread alone. Maybe if the last thread hadn't been locked to prevent comments and complaints you would have seen many more.

I don't see any resent or negativity except what's in this thread. Can you post an example?

You should drop by chat every now and then. Many people stopped posting it here because the moderation/administration team doesn't really seem to care as you can see.

#13 Silent J

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:18 PM

When a thread gets deleted and the OP gets a message with an explanation via PM, everyone else is left in the dark. This detracts from the pleasantness of the board's atmosphere. But more importantly, it pits the point of view of the moderator against that of the OP, and the latter is left with little recourse. The moderators are only human and make mistakes, and so it would be beneficial if the entire board could judge (via discussion) whether a moderating action was right or not [with 'right' being defined here as 'consistent with board guidelines'].

Yeah. I don't know of any board which spends its time justifying every act to the entire membership. So while you bring up a good point, this 'business' will not run like that.
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#14 Razie

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:20 PM

Yeah. I don't know of any board which spends its time justifying every act to the entire membership. So while you bring up a good point, this 'business' will not run like that.

Frumkeit without Mentchlichkeit is not Yiddishkeit!

#15 Xi

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:20 PM

Yeah. I don't know of any board which spends its time justifying every act to the entire membership. So while you bring up a good point, this 'business' will not run like that.


There would be very little time spent on justification if the actions themselves weren't so random and capricious.
Xi is intimidating, in an endearing sort of way. --Gretchen

#16 int

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:22 PM

Yeah. I don't know of any board which spends its time justifying every act to the entire membership. So while you bring up a good point, this 'business' will not run like that.


Maybe, but I don't know of any board which [almost] never justifies any act, but just keeps people in the dark.

#17 Rachel

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:24 PM

Maybe, but I don't know of any board which [almost] never justifies any act, but just keeps people in the dark.

Exactly. And the best way for members to understand what posts are not appropriate is to read the explanations from mods for posts being removed. Transparency will help this issue.
Authentic jews work in climate controlled offices. Physical exertion is for goyim. - Melech

I think that should be the answer to everything on H.com. It was God's plan that these kids should end up in prison in Japan, just as it was God's plan that certain 8th graders shouldn't be accepted to either of the two schools they applied to. And also that a thirteen-year old should have a kid and that certain people should dream of sex with the president. It solves all problems with no need for discussion. - Xi

#18 Silent J

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:24 PM

Because people know it will get deleted. There's tons of anger. A lot of it is discussed in chat since it can't be discussed here. I've been angry at a lot of mod actions, but given the lack of trust and my lack of confidence in fixing anything through mod PM, I'd rather vent in chat.

It's fine with me. If members want to vent themselves out in chat, it's better than posting it here.

We can't make everyone happy.

There is half a dozen in this thread alone. Maybe if the last thread hadn't been locked to prevent comments and complaints you would have seen many more.

You should drop by chat every now and then. Many people stopped posting it here because the moderation/administration team doesn't really seem to care as you can see.

Like I said, the negativity is in this thread. The rest of the site is fine.
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#19 Rachel

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:24 PM

There would be very little time spent on justification if the actions themselves weren't so random and capricious.

This
Authentic jews work in climate controlled offices. Physical exertion is for goyim. - Melech

I think that should be the answer to everything on H.com. It was God's plan that these kids should end up in prison in Japan, just as it was God's plan that certain 8th graders shouldn't be accepted to either of the two schools they applied to. And also that a thirteen-year old should have a kid and that certain people should dream of sex with the president. It solves all problems with no need for discussion. - Xi

#20 Silent J

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 09:26 PM

Frumkeit without Mentchlichkeit is not Yiddishkeit!

Your point?

Maybe, but I don't know of any board which [almost] never justifies any act, but just keeps people in the dark.

Like I said, check via PM.

There would be very little time spent on justification if the actions themselves weren't so random and capricious.

Example?
Frumkeit without Mentchlichkeit is not Yiddishkeit!

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