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#21 shteigher

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Posted 02 March 2005 - 08:39 PM

After seeing this thread I thought it would be good if we have a Daf Yomi thread for those of us who are learning or starting to learn Daf Yomi.
Any thoughts anyone?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In any event this thread should be in Divrei Torah and essays and not in Jewish Fundamentals.
At least that's my opinion.
"Vayaminu Bashem UveMoshe Avdo" (Shemos 14:31)

#22 critic

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Posted 02 March 2005 - 09:37 PM

So do we or do we not hold like the chachamim?

#23 Guest_melech_*

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Posted 02 March 2005 - 09:39 PM

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#24 Kalashnikover_Rebbe

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Posted 02 March 2005 - 10:13 PM

After seeing this thread I thought it would be good if we have a Daf Yomi thread for those of us who are learning or starting to learn Daf Yomi.
Any thoughts anyone?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In any event this thread should be in Divrei Torah and essays and not in Jewish Fundamentals.
At least that's my opinion.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


It also should be in MS's SIG for the blatant illegal apostrophe in the title.
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#25 Aristotle

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Posted 02 March 2005 - 11:54 PM

"L'hagdil Torah Ul'ha'adirah"

I fourth the notion.
.כלל הדבר, כי ראוי שיהיה השכל בן חורין -מהר"ל בחיד"א

#26 shim

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 08:18 AM

Because we don't hold like the chachamim.

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Then how could you say it became the halacha like the chachamim?

#27 critic

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 08:43 AM

That's why I asked if it was indeed hold like the chachamim.

#28 Sweet

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 11:09 AM

But perhaps the key point is that Adam was an individual implementing a fence, and thats improper.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But it was a unanimous decision!
The question arises before Rabban Gamliel. What did the Rabbanan want you to do b'dieved? I think the obvious answer is, you are over a d'rabbanan for missing chatzos, but you can still be yotzeh d'oraysoh.
The world has too many stupid people who are full of confidence, and smart people who are full of self-doubt.

#29 Guest_melech_*

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 11:39 AM

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#30 critic

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 11:46 AM

Grammar never was my strong point. But you're right, chumrot would have been correct.

#31 Sweet

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 11:47 AM



It also should be in MS's SIG for the blatant illegal apostrophe in the title.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think there might be grammatical grounds to permit the apostrophe is this case. It's pluralizing a foreign word; it's not a possessive. That being said, I would have opted for, "chumrot".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I did not know that rule. Thank you.
The world has too many stupid people who are full of confidence, and smart people who are full of self-doubt.

#32 Guest_melech_*

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 11:53 AM

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#33 shim

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 12:23 PM

But perhaps the key point is that Adam was an individual implementing a fence, and thats improper.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But it was a unanimous decision!
The question arises before Rabban Gamliel. What did the Rabbanan want you to do b'dieved? I think the obvious answer is, you are over a d'rabbanan for missing chatzos, but you can still be yotzeh d'oraysoh.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, you are yotseh deoraisa bdiavad. But if the rabannan wanted you to say shema anyway, how can you say that you are over a drabbanan?

#34 Sweet

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 12:29 PM

But perhaps the key point is that Adam was an individual implementing a fence, and thats improper.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But it was a unanimous decision!
The question arises before Rabban Gamliel. What did the Rabbanan want you to do b'dieved? I think the obvious answer is, you are over a d'rabbanan for missing chatzos, but you can still be yotzeh d'oraysoh.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, you are yotseh deoraisa bdiavad. But if the rabannan wanted you to say shema anyway, how can you say that you are over a drabbanan?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

1.There is no difference in the torah between L'chatchila and B'dieved.
2.If someone marries an erva d'rabbanan, do the Rabbanan want him to give a get? They still want you to do what the torah says.
The world has too many stupid people who are full of confidence, and smart people who are full of self-doubt.

#35 shim

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 12:38 PM

1. Of course, I used the term "bdiavad" in the literal sense of "if he did it", not in the common "second best" useage. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear.

2. Of course they want you to fulfill what the Torah says. But one can think of many examples where the chachamim placed conditions that were oker the performance of a deoraisa, such as shofar on shabbos. I don't know that you can say that the chachamim want you to say shema before chatzos but they also want you to say it after chatzos if you missed it.

#36 Sweet

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 12:40 PM

1. Of course, I used the term "bdiavad" in the literal sense of "if he did it", not in the common "second best" useage. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear.

2. Of course they want you to fulfill what the Torah says. But one can think of many examples where the chachamim placed conditions that were oker the performance of a deoraisa, such as shofar on shabbos. I don't know that you can say that the chachamim want you to say shema before chatzos but they also want you to say it after chatzos if you missed it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I hear ya.
The world has too many stupid people who are full of confidence, and smart people who are full of self-doubt.

#37 Gabbe

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 02:09 PM

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#38 shim

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 02:16 PM

Thanks Gabbe.

Of course that begs the question why then did R. Gamliel instruct his sons to say shema.

#39 Gabbe

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 02:27 PM

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#40 Guest_melech_*

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Posted 03 March 2005 - 08:54 PM

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